Tuesday, September 24, 2013

M age 46 seeks F 60-78

OkCupid logo 2012.png"Bravo on an interesting profile, and for being open to seeing a somewhat younger man," the message from "desire4mature" on OK Cupid began. "There is no better match when it all comes together between the right older woman and younger man. He will be a lucky man. I admire from afar, and I wish you well."

Afar? Yes, really afar. My suitor, "desire4mature," is 46, M, straight, available, and lives in London, United Kingdom (5335 miles from me). His message intrigued me, though, so I read his profile. It echoed the views of many men who have written to me for advice about connecting with older women -- but with such an articulate flair that I wrote to ask him for permission to quote from it. Here are some excerpts, with his permission:

...I seek a mature, ageless, energetic woman for undeniable chemistry...physical, emotional, and intellectual chemistry ...  

You are better today than you have ever been, more alive, more free, more wise and more sensual, still with unquenched desires. You are most likely over 60, completely ageless in mind and spirit, smart, well-preserved and fun.  

Are you are bursting with energy, but have difficulty finding a man your age who can match your liveliness? Do you want someone whom with whom you can be your true self, free and at ease, knowing you are accepted and desired no matter your age, with someone who accepts you as you are who sees your age and youthfulness and wisdom as assets to be treasured? ... Can you envision yourself in a passionate and intense love affair with a smart, youthful man who sees you as the beautiful and amazing woman you have become, who values your wisdom and life experience and zest and passion, who can harness your deep sensuality and match your desire, with no insecurities, welcoming you to realize your true Goddess nature?  If so, I would love to know you. 

You will feel and welcome my desire for you, for the woman you are today, not the woman you were 20 or 30 years ago. We both know how much better you are now, smarter, wiser, more accepting and free, more sensual and appreciative, more full of zest and life .... 

"So how is that working for you?" I had to ask him, explaining that my inquiry was less from prurient interest than from wanting to inform those of you who keep asking me about how to meet older women. Is a dating site like OK Cupid a good place?

"desire4mature" listed for me the many categories of women who would not respond to his ad, or who would not interest him, leaving a precious few who became his friends and then lovers. He said in an email,

It is a very rare woman that I end up talking to for a longer periods of time and then meeting and becoming lovers. Sexual health is very important too, so again, it's rare to get to that point for me, but I have, and have gloriously been rewarded to have known or know a small handful of truly amazing, incredible, sensual and beautifully sexual women, all 20 to 33 years older than me. I love and cherish them and always will.

My questions to my readers:

If you're the older woman, could you see yourself getting involved with a man like this one? What sort of screening test would you use to decide whether he was sincere and a good potential bed partner?

If you're the younger man, have you tried using an online dating site to find an older women who might be a good match for you?

If you're a man of our generation, what do you offer women our age that a younger man does not?

I welcome your comments.


Update 10/7/2013: I just received yet another email from a young man -- this one is 25 -- who wants to date "a granny." (I understand that in other countries, this isn't an offensive term -- though it makes me cringe.) His request for my advice had no caps, and many words were abbreviated ("frm," "lyk," "sm1," "whoz," "plz," for example). If he won't even take the time to communicate with me correctly, why would I think he has something to offer a woman my age?

Young men -- it's not that we're not savvy enough to read your text-speak -- we can read it. But approaching us this way does not make you appealing or interesting.  (For more info and a bit of ranting about this, please see this 2009 post.)

As always, I welcome your candid and thoughtful comments.*

* However, as always, do not try to hijack my readers to a toy store, escort service, porn site, or any site I haven't endorsed. Those comments are deleted before seeing the light of day. I wish the spammers would stop making me cranky.


  1. I'm a tad put off by this guy. Seems he is cruising for older women not for a relationship but just for sex. He doesn't mention love, friendship, compatibility, sharing interests. I've always been suspicious of guys who talk about passionate
    intense love affairs in the personals. Mostly they just want to get laid and figure older women will be easier to get into bed. What does this guy look like anyway. One wonders.

  2. At first I wasn't going to comment as I've never done the online dating thing, but after thinking this over a few things come to mind.

    First meeting anyone online through a dating/match making site one should be cautious and perhaps meet the person at a safe neutral place like a coffee shop, book store, or mall food court. Meet them, get to know them a little, and then take it from there.

    AskErica above has some good points, it's hard to know anyone's intentions, but for myself married to an older woman, that wasn't my intentions when I asked her out for coffee.

    As to the guy in the okcupid profile he could just be looking to hook up for sex. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing if an older woman wants the same. But I don't think from just a few paragraphs one could dismiss him not being interested in a more permanent and romantic loving relationship.

    I'm a younger guy with an older woman, but in defense of older men or a partner with not too large of an age gap would be being in much of the same place and stages in life.

    I thinks it's quite interesting that for a long time no one thought much of older men with much younger women, but it seems to get socially a different consideration of an older woman with a younger man.

    much respect

  3. First, maybe I've some credibility here, hard to say. I online dated a decade back for 5 years, during ages 54-59 on Match & eHarmony and even in print ads. I found the right lady, got married. It worked because I worked it like a 20 hr a week job. NOT easy. The self discovery part was the hardest.

    Joan, my thoughts on this guy's online efforts go to TV. I'm hooked on Breaking Bad. And, BTW, I haven't watched a TV show in 15 years, not since Survivors, 1st edition. I stream BB. Don't even own a TV. I think when a man or a woman is staring down a limited number of years as mild mannered HS Chem teacher Walter White is in BB, you get open to wild. You do things you might never have even dreamed of. That's why this crazy plot works. You care less what people think at my age, at Walter's age and with his cancer.

    Example: I'm slowly coming out as a sex geek/writer/thinker/blogger memoir guy (Sex With Librarians and God, 2014) largely because of my age. Who cares what people think about us now, right? At my age, 65?

    Bottom line: men love wild women. A woman who who is up against limited grains of sand fast falling in the glass? She just might try anything. Men like that.

    Maybe I'm dead wrong just reading Shameless: How I Ditched the Diet, Got Naked, Found True Pleasure...and Somehow Got Home in Time To Cook Dinner... by Pamela Madsen, this is a big part of her message, why she woke up. Eros and Thanatos for heaven's sake. Her clock was ticking and she wanted to find her best, older Wild Woman.

    Anyway, I think that's why younger men like older women. Caution? Who gives a crap now. Let's get naked.

    So your comments are on. like older women/men are (I'm 65) you tend to be more open to Badass.

  4. Every male likes older female but in this case I would say that this may be "too much" :)

    1. What's too old? When you are 75 and she's 60 and your mr. happy is no longer Mr. Happy. Then she is sad and you join her. Better to age together I say. Betty Dodson called death recently the ultimate intimate ecstatic sex act. I think she's on to something. The money thing and the age thing? Balance makes for better flying.

  5. Maybe he had an absent mother and is still trying to fill the void in his life.

  6. "Maybe he had an absent mother and is still trying to fill the void in his life"

    I'm sorry, but I actually really don't like that. It does get said but I think there are some real problems with that way of thinking about a younger guy being interest in/attracted to an older woman.

    First why wouldn't a young man be interested in an attractive older woman?
    Or maybe walking through the mall see an attractive older woman and take a second glance etc....

    Then it implies that only a young guy with some issues would/could ever actually be attracted to an older woman. That some how an older woman isn't still attractive even to a younger guy.

    Additionally that seems to only get applied to a scenario of an older woman with a younger man.
    It doesn't get applied to an older guy with a younger woman.

    A friend of mine and my work out partner is 65. He's in great shape. I wouldn't have guessed him older than 50 or early 50's. He likes and dates woman in their 30's or 40's and apparently they are interested in him.

    Why wouldn't an attractive 50 or 60 something woman be attractive to men in their 30's, 40', 50's and 60's?

    1. I am a divorced woman, 63, healthy libido, but wary.

      Younger women attach to older men due to their status, income, perceived ability to maintain financial stability and support, and the likelihood of providing for the woman/children after he dies -- things the women might not find with their peers still climbing the social ladder. They count on their young bodies and sexuality to keep him interested, but unfortunately, too many men seeking significantly younger women (10 years or more) most likely will move onto ever-younger women as they get bored or impatient. Younger women who try to pin such a man down by having his child are asking for trouble and heartache.

      Don't fall for anecdotal evidence that this will all work out, be OK, because someone's cousin or someone on the web says it worked out wonderfully for them. Get real -- how many successful such couples do you actually know?

      A gross generalization, but one with truth: Younger men seeking older women for the reasons detailed above are higly unlikely to stick around for long. They, too, have access to young women. They will not like to be laughed at or endure peer or societal pressure unless they have a screw loose, are parasites, or are sociopaths. Be careful out there!

  7. I have a girlfriend older than me (14 years more), and I love her too much!!

  8. I would worry not so much that he is cruising for sex, but for money. Single/divorced/widowed middle-aged women are easy prey for narcissists and other sociopaths, especially men looking for women a generation or two younger (I know from experience, as my ex is one and has always exploited women whether married or not, which I didn't know before we married). I cannot imagine letting myself start a relationship with someone I don't already know in at least a tangential way. He would have to have some connection with my friends, work environment, neighborhood, political culture, any social environment that I could check out to see if he's for real. Then, ask him about his early childhood, his family, his schooling, any background questions at all -- no need to be an interrogation or all at once -- and watch for red flags: Is he inconsistent with his answers? Does he get angry or irritated with the questions? Is he over-the-top with compliments? Do some things just seem a bit off? Does he spend time with a lot of women he calls "just friends?" (Sociopaths may groom a woman for years before making their moves.) Does he have any male friends or activities outside of work? Is he secretive, withholding, furtive about his whereabouts or finances? Geez, age is one of the least-important considerations, though I will say an old man-young woman relationship is not equally comparable to its opposite for many reasons. Basically, don't try to fool yourself or lie to yourself or let a younger man flatter you into poverty or heartbreak.

  9. I am the younger man that Joan started this blog about. I hadn't checked in in awhile, and I am disappointed in some of the closed minded comments. I would have expected a more open minded audience here. Anyway, just a few clarifications for those trying to analyze why I am the way I am. I am a successful professional, well-educated, caring man who has a great relationship with his mother. I am not just cruising older women for sex, as I have had two major LTR's with women 20-30 years older than me, and I seek only one, ongoing affair for the long term, where intimacy and passion grow over time. I am quite well off on my own, so I am not looking for a purse, rather I consider myself a generous man. There is some truth to what the one post referred to about some older women realizing that time is short, so find a way to enjoy as much as you can. I view it more as a realization that they are free to do as they please, and they want to do it well and get and receive as much pleasure as they can. I reciprocate that desire. Sure there are younger men out there that want a much older women for all the wrong reasons. But there are also some of us out here who want an older woman for all the right reasons as well.

    1. I'm glad you returned to read the comments. Yes, they run the gamut from being totally supportive to figuring out all the creepy wrong reasons a younger man might pursue older women. I like your calm and candid response, and I hope others will rethink jumping to conclusions about you.

      "[T]here are also some of us out here who want an older woman for all the right reasons as well." Yes, I believe that you are one of those men.

  10. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

  11. Note to Franz whose comment does not (yet) appear here. You made excellent points, and I'd like to let your comment appear -- but I do not let commenters include links to sex toy retailers that I have not vetted. If you wish to rewrite your comment without that, I'll be pleased to let it publish. Your points are good.

  12. AnonymousMay 31, 2014

    Joan, just checking back in again. Thanks for your support on my views as that younger man. I have recently begun seeing a terrific 64 yo woman here in London, and we are having a terrific time, an electric connection of both mind and body. I hope more women who read your site and are seeking a lively sex and relationship life will consider the sincere younger men of us out here for a potential relationship, and will share their beauty and wisdom with someone who can love and appreciate them for the terrific women they have matured into! Brava the ageless, sensual woman!!

    1. Thank you for this happy update! You were sincere about what you were seeking, and you found it.


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